ideal WB AFR for the L67s?

fst100 · 11-29-2007

for the grand prix's i heard/understand the ideal AFR on the WB(non-intercooled or non-alkied) is somewhere between 11.5-11.9. since im running alcohol, i read various areas from ppl saying the WB will be running richer than 11.5-11.8, but others say alcohol enables to run leaner such as 11.8-12.1. Right now my WB(PLX-SMR) shows im running ~10.5 and other times it'll go below 10.1. Am I on the right track or am i doing the tuning wrong with alcohol?

mods:
98GTP The Purple People Eater
best ET=13.6 best trap=102.5
1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs
LS1M/HappyKnob@19* of Timing/PT
AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller
180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90
PLX-SMR WBo2

pacemkr86 · 11-29-2007

your right on the money.... thats the a/f ratio is shoot for, but im not a Grand Prix guru.. hopefully chance or dvldoc while post up in here

fst100 · 12-03-2007

any other input?

Rocket468 · 12-03-2007

Yea thats a good spot to be. You getting any kr? After alcohol I ended up having to put dynomat on my tranny to quite it down during shifts. But I have no kr here.

fst100 · 12-03-2007

yes i do get massive KR at around the shift points as much as 7* o_O; and some in between the gears, like .1-1*. i dont recall what my WB was at during both runs but i recorded my runs via the LS1M and noticed my O2s for the NB was ranging 970-980s and my injector pulse widths(IPW) were maxxing out at 21ms on the stock injectors. i dont know whether i was getting real/lean KR or rich KR. im gonna do a 0-80mph run when i leave work with the current setup and see if i get KR as well as pay attention to my WB.

fst100 · 01-03-2008

had a lil debate on alcohol user's AFR on the WB. heres the link:
ClubGP Message Forum troubleshooting
basically a member there said a 10.x AFR is too rich to run and that another alcohol user was able to run a 12.5 AFR on the WB to low 12s, but i dont know what his mod list was that he was able to run that. this is why i always ask what the ideal AFR is on here as well as in other threads cause ppl have mixed feelings on alcohol and how to tune it. any help is greatly appreciated from the experts.

fst100 · 01-05-2008

heres my argument. from clubgp a guy nicknamed roadracer96 ran his car with this mod list running 12.4AFR:
ZZP Stage 3 heads
XPZ cam
L36 block
SLP Headers
3" Catback, no cat
3.29 gears
Stock Diff
Gen V
2.8 pulley
4" CAI
85mm MAF
2750 ZZP Converter
110 leaded gas
BFG DRs
Full weight, no spare tire
22-23* timing (IIRC)
LOTS OF TUNING

12.23@112.92mph, 1.74 60-foot

so which is which or does he have more mods that allow him to run leaner than the average L67?

pacemkr86 · 01-06-2008

he is running 110 octane, therefore he doesnt need as much alcohol.. thats why he runs his leaner

fst100 · 01-06-2008

very interesting observation, is that why he was able to run lean that much?

Chris98vobra · 01-06-2008

Absolutely. Makes all the difference in the world.

11-29-2007	#1 (permalink)
fst100 Alcohol Water Injection Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 96	ideal WB AFR for the L67s? for the grand prix's i heard/understand the ideal AFR on the WB(non-intercooled or non-alkied) is somewhere between 11.5-11.9. since im running alcohol, i read various areas from ppl saying the WB will be running richer than 11.5-11.8, but others say alcohol enables to run leaner such as 11.8-12.1. Right now my WB(PLX-SMR) shows im running ~10.5 and other times it'll go below 10.1. Am I on the right track or am i doing the tuning wrong with alcohol? mods: 98GTP The Purple People Eater best ET=13.6 best trap=102.5 1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs LS1M/HappyKnob@19* of Timing/PT AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller 180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90 PLX-SMR WBo2 Last edited by fst100; 11-29-2007 at 02:18 PM.

11-29-2007	#2 (permalink)
pacemkr86 DevilsOwn Tech Year: 86 Make: Buick Model: T Type Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 644	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? your right on the money.... thats the a/f ratio is shoot for, but im not a Grand Prix guru.. hopefully chance or dvldoc while post up in here __________________ Phil Underwood My Turbo Buick

12-03-2007	#3 (permalink)
fst100 Alcohol Water Injection Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 96	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? any other input? __________________ 98GTP The Purple People Eater best ET=13.19 best trap=105.36 1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs LS1M/HappyKnob@18* of Timing/PT AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller 180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90 PLX-SMR WBo2 Fuel Pump Rewire, AFC 2.2

12-03-2007	#4 (permalink)
Rocket468 DevilsOwn Staff Year: 2000 Make: Pontiac Model: Grand Prix Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,105	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? Yea thats a good spot to be. You getting any kr? After alcohol I ended up having to put dynomat on my tranny to quite it down during shifts. But I have no kr here.

12-03-2007	#5 (permalink)
fst100 Alcohol Water Injection Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 96	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? yes i do get massive KR at around the shift points as much as 7* o_O; and some in between the gears, like .1-1. i dont recall what my WB was at during both runs but i recorded my runs via the LS1M and noticed my O2s for the NB was ranging 970-980s and my injector pulse widths(IPW) were maxxing out at 21ms on the stock injectors. i dont know whether i was getting real/lean KR or rich KR. im gonna do a 0-80mph run when i leave work with the current setup and see if i get KR as well as pay attention to my WB. __________________ 98GTP The Purple People Eater best ET=13.19 best trap=105.36 1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs LS1M/HappyKnob@18 of Timing/PT AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller 180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90 PLX-SMR WBo2 Fuel Pump Rewire, AFC 2.2

01-03-2008	#6 (permalink)
fst100 Alcohol Water Injection Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 96	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? had a lil debate on alcohol user's AFR on the WB. heres the link: ClubGP Message Forum troubleshooting basically a member there said a 10.x AFR is too rich to run and that another alcohol user was able to run a 12.5 AFR on the WB to low 12s, but i dont know what his mod list was that he was able to run that. this is why i always ask what the ideal AFR is on here as well as in other threads cause ppl have mixed feelings on alcohol and how to tune it. any help is greatly appreciated from the experts. __________________ 98GTP The Purple People Eater best ET=13.19 best trap=105.36 1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs LS1M/HappyKnob@18* of Timing/PT AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller 180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90 PLX-SMR WBo2 Fuel Pump Rewire, AFC 2.2

01-05-2008	#7 (permalink)
fst100 Alcohol Water Injection Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 96	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? heres my argument. from clubgp a guy nicknamed roadracer96 ran his car with this mod list running 12.4AFR: ZZP Stage 3 heads XPZ cam L36 block SLP Headers 3" Catback, no cat 3.29 gears Stock Diff Gen V 2.8 pulley 4" CAI 85mm MAF 2750 ZZP Converter 110 leaded gas BFG DRs Full weight, no spare tire 22-23* timing (IIRC) LOTS OF TUNING 12.23@112.92mph, 1.74 60-foot so which is which or does he have more mods that allow him to run leaner than the average L67? __________________ 98GTP The Purple People Eater best ET=13.19 best trap=105.36 1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs LS1M/HappyKnob@18* of Timing/PT AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller 180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90 PLX-SMR WBo2 Fuel Pump Rewire, AFC 2.2

01-06-2008	#8 (permalink)
pacemkr86 DevilsOwn Tech Year: 86 Make: Buick Model: T Type Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 644	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? he is running 110 octane, therefore he doesnt need as much alcohol.. thats why he runs his leaner __________________ Phil Underwood My Turbo Buick

01-06-2008	#9 (permalink)
fst100 Alcohol Water Injection Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 96	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? very interesting observation, is that why he was able to run lean that much? __________________ 98GTP The Purple People Eater best ET=13.19 best trap=105.36 1.9 mod rockers 3.2"-Headers-2.5"Pipes-stock muffs LS1M/HappyKnob@18* of Timing/PT AL103@0.040 alcohol w/m3 nozzle an Controller 180Dr T-Stat, 4"FWI/PortedTB/PnP M90 PLX-SMR WBo2 Fuel Pump Rewire, AFC 2.2

01-06-2008	#10 (permalink)
Chris98vobra Water Injection Year: 1998 Make: Mustang Model: Cobra Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 15	Re: ideal WB AFR for the L67s? Absolutely. Makes all the difference in the world. __________________ 1998 Cobra 17lbs of Novi 2000 boost Fully built and Alcohol injected http://beast.freehomepage.com